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  1. #111
    Gooer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UndeadSweeper View Post
    Why couldn't she use the ones that Micheal is using? It sound like they don't have any password or lock on them. So can she look at them and delete her presence on them if she happen to pass one.
    I think they hid the cameras, instead of leaving them in plain sight....

  2. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by LiamKerrington View Post
    No. Not all the people. I, for example, have a lot of trouble accepting anything in that direction. Riley turns to the dark side of things, and I don't like it, appreciate it, support it, love it, or whatever; the opposite is true actually. And from what I read there is quite a number of WA fans that have bad feelings about Riley acting that way, too.

    But in general I tend to agree with you: there are enough Riley-fans or Survivor-fans which seem to live by double-standards, which is btw quite common especially with civilized people.

    edit 1:
    [Actually I would like to "like" your posting; but since you put all Riley fans into the same pot of argument/ opinion or whatever (ie accepting her to do some torturing), I don't feel like doing so.]

    edit 2:
    As for Riley performing torture on Tardust: As for now we only have reason to believe that she is going to do it; but yet she has not done it, right? So maybe Burt and/or her own sanity will hinder her enough.

    Best wishes!
    Liam

    I put everyone into that category not for being a fan of Riley, but for their staunch refusal to see Scratch as a person with problems, and merely a being of pure, unredeemable evil. They tend to be the same people who lost their minds over Kalani being the rat, but felt sorry for him because of the circumstance they were privy to, roundly accepting his last act as one of redemption. The double standard is what turns me off. I don't care if you like the post or not, it doesn't stop it from being true, the Kalani fiasco is proof of this.
    joint-point-counter-joint

  3. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gooer View Post
    I think they hid the cameras, instead of leaving them in plain sight....
    If she was monitor them all this time, she would know to look for.
    Z Sniper: I'm gonna die????!!!! God**** it,....i wish people would tell me these things!
    KC : Hee hee hee.... *giggling in corner.
    Z Sniper: You are evil,.......*crying in corner.


    Z Sniper: I bestow you SUPER MUCHO MACHO MAN!


    *Proud member of the Victor's Mucho Macho Fan Club*
    Member of the CJ Defense Force: Because no one else will.

  4. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Osiris View Post
    Did I say it would? I don't see that in my post.
    You did: it is implied in the rethorical question at the end and the sarcastic Pfft... Ha!
    I'm merely pointing out something important:
    Now, that is more interesting! But... did you said so? I don't see that in your post :P

    We all love Burt and Riley, right? They're decent people pushed too far. We only know this because we're given their stories, we're made to love them. Now we're being shown how their history twists them to do terrible things. All the people who've cried out for Scratch's blood are going to revel in Riley getting her information... by whatever means necessary, and they're okay with it because they understand what she went through to get to that place. That's a luxury Scratch was never given.
    I disagree. The general tone of the reactions here on the forum is actually leaning a lot towards a strong criticism of Riley and a strong disapproval of her intentions. Most of the people understand what she went through and still disagree with her. Even the people who approved this torturing business did so without throwing parties but rather with a lot of caveats. I might have missed a post of two with the kind of enthusiastic reaction you describe as "reveling" but it's hardly a generalized reaction.
    Now, "screen time" has been a lot longer for Riley than for Scratch, since the show puts the towerites in the forefront, I'll give you that, but I disagree when you say Scratch's road to the dark side was not presented to us. Riley got more time at the forefront because her road takes place, in time, in parallel with the story. Scratch is presented to us as an already accomplished character, and she evolves very very little during the story, aside from the short intimate moment with Lizzy at the hospital. But KC did it the only way he could, he gave us the backstory of her being raped once and almost twice, and her pregnancy. You yourself note this in your post. That's powerful stuff, even if it's not covering as many minutes in the show as all of Riley's evolution. Again, I think we do see the reasons for her being like she is, and still disapprove her.

    You can say, "But... but she's evil," all you want, but the fact is Riley is about to head down the same road, taking Burt along with her. What does that say about either of them, about us?
    About them it says, as I mentioned in my first post, that they are horrifying. I don't know about all of us, but I'm pretty happy with what my reaction says about me

    I've said from the start Scratch is misunderstood, and has a great deal of trauma in her life that shaped her into the person she had to be to survive, a theory that was proven by the reveal of her sexual and physical abuse.
    See, I was referring to this part above.

    Riley has reached a point of no return, there will be zero redemption for her in the eyes of all but the hypocrite if she goes through with her plan to torture the information out of Tardust. I'd be very surprised if Kc pussed out during the writing process, and lets Riley back down--or be talked down by Burt. BUT! We'll see what happens.
    I totally agree. She will be corrupted with no way back. We'll see.

  5. #115
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    What's up with the 12 pages only?!
    Likes Verse liked this post

  6. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by UndeadSweeper View Post
    Why couldn't she use the ones that Micheal is using? It sound like they don't have any password or lock on them. So can she look at them and delete her presence on them if she happen to pass one.
    What I'm saying is that she'd have to have wireless ones working during the storm, receive the pictures via airwaves, see B&R get to the greenhouse and set her plan in motion by sending Tardust. Even if she had wireless cameras, which is unlikely, the communications would be distorted by the storm which is already happening when Burt and Riley leave the house (they make a comment on that).
    With the spotters she'd have to go on site and get the photos manually, which makes it even more unlikely in my opinion.

  7. #117
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    I think either Riley will carry out the torture, realise she made a horrible mistake, and will be mentally changed, or start the torture and questions herself as to who she has become....

    Also, i realise that Scratch did have lots of problems, many we don't know of, which made her into who she is. But, the results of that are what make her evil, due to her growing up interactions and environment, not necessarily just on her own accord. Although she does seem to enjoy doing what she does......

  8. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by clem131 View Post
    You did: it is implied in the rethorical question at the end and the sarcastic Pfft... Ha!


    Now, that is more interesting! But... did you said so? I don't see that in your post :P



    I disagree. The general tone of the reactions here on the forum is actually leaning a lot towards a strong criticism of Riley and a strong disapproval of her intentions. Most of the people understand what she went through and still disagree with her. Even the people who approved this torturing business did so without throwing parties but rather with a lot of caveats. I might have missed a post of two with the kind of enthusiastic reaction you describe as "reveling" but it's hardly a generalized reaction.
    Now, "screen time" has been a lot longer for Riley than for Scratch, since the show puts the towerites in the forefront, I'll give you that, but I disagree when you say Scratch's road to the dark side was not presented to us. Riley got more time at the forefront because her road takes place, in time, in parallel with the story. Scratch is presented to us as an already accomplished character, and she evolves very very little during the story, aside from the short intimate moment with Lizzy at the hospital. But KC did it the only way he could, he gave us the backstory of her being raped once and almost twice, and her pregnancy. You yourself note this in your post. That's powerful stuff, even if it's not covering as many minutes in the show as all of Riley's evolution. Again, I think we do see the reasons for her being like she is, and still disapprove her.



    About them it says, as I mentioned in my first post, that they are horrifying. I don't know about all of us, but I'm pretty happy with what my reaction says about me



    See, I was referring to this part above.



    I totally agree. She will be corrupted with no way back. We'll see.
    You've completely missed my point, but exemplified it profoundly. Thanks.
    Likes Gooer liked this post
    joint-point-counter-joint

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Osiris View Post

    I put everyone into that category not for being a fan of Riley, but for their staunch refusal to see Scratch as a person with problems, and merely a being of pure, unredeemable evil. They tend to be the same people who lost their minds over Kalani being the rat, but felt sorry for him because of the circumstance they were privy to, roundly accepting his last act as one of redemption. The double standard is what turns me off. I don't care if you like the post or not, it doesn't stop it from being true, the Kalani fiasco is proof of this.
    Scratch is a really interesting character and I agree with you 100% that she is just another person with problems. In my opinion, I think the story leads people to hate her as we don't get the same level of detail about her as we do of the other characters. All of our experiences with Scratch are from the point of view of the "good guys" in the story. It's easy for them to hate her given what has happened and in a live-or-die type of situation it's reasonable.

    At some point I think it'd be really interesting to see Scratch's journal. Maybe after the show is finished? It could explain a lot of questions I have about her and others may have too. What did she do before Z-Day? What was it that caused her and Latch to be so close? Yeah they're siblings but their bond seems to go much further than that. Did she go through a progression like we're seeing with Riley? For all we know she could've been a kindergarten teacher at one point. It'd be great to get the other side of the story.

    Kc, there's a money-generating idea for you. Sell the Scratch journal to make some money for your next project! With as thorough as you are about the story, I wouldn't be surprised if an outline of one exists already anyways.

    ETA:
    Quote Originally Posted by clem131 View Post
    She will be corrupted with no way back. We'll see.
    There's always a way back!
    Last edited by Jannit; May 6th, 2014 at 11:46 AM.
    Likes Storm, Witch_Doctor, Osiris liked this post

  10. #120
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    Riley is toast..... She will get killed, which will spare Burt from having to tell her about Lizzy....


    Or as she is dying she will tell Burt to tell Lizzy goodbye or something..... And Burt will say he will.... And then we will all cry a single tear!
    Likes Storm, Jannit liked this post


 
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